Editor's note: Eric, a developer (we checked -- he's legit), writes about the lesser-known, more unfortunate effects of game bashing.
I don't necessarily agree with everything he says. A reviewer or podcaster has free-speech rights to talk about a game however he wants, however professionally or unprofessionally he wants. And he doesn't have to be a game designer (or be empathetic toward one) to do it, too. Just like a movie critic doesn't need to be a movie director or actor to rip into one.
But Eric's message is still one very much worth reading...something critics should think about. Not necessarily to temper their opinions or styles, but moreso just to open their eyes to the greater responsibilities they hold to the industry in general. -Shoe
I've been playing games since the NES, I've been reading about them since Nintendo Power, and I've been making them for seven years now. I am one of those guys who views games as art and wants to see the medium elevated to a status on par with books and movies.
Now there are many, many roadblocks keeping us as an industry from getting there. One I want to touch on today is the gaming press -- a topic that has been beaten to death but is still an important issue. You see, with the secrecy that surrounds all of the development of games, the press is the window through which the public sees and experiences our products before the game hits the shelves.
I read reviews, previews, listen to podcasts, and basically consume as much game media as possible. Which brings me to the title of this blog. I read today about the closure of GRIN, the Sweden-based developer of such games as Bionic Commando, Wanted, and Terminator Salvation.
Now me, I've only played the two Bionic Commando games they made. I LOVED both of them. Yes the PS3/360 version had its issues. But when I read reviews and listen to podcasts I hear these guys (and some girls) totally rip the game to shreds, in ways that are not professional at all.
There is a right and wrong way to criticize something. It's called constructive feedback. Instead of blasting the game with juvenile snarkiness, be the professional you're supposed to be. I hear the comment all the time, "Well I'm no game designer but...." But what?
If you can rip on the game, but then try and justify the reason you can't come up with a better idea by saying you're not a game maker...well then what makes you qualified to tear it apart?
Believe it or not, game reviews go into consideration when a publisher looks to sign a deal with a development house. I can't help but think that the continual bashing GRIN received in the past 6 months had some part to play in its closure.
People spend their lives making these games -- it takes years to produce just one product. Very often, insane hours are involved that are very destructive to the developers' personal lives and health (yes even on budget titles no one cares about). We read these reviews and listen to these podcasts.
It is VERY painful to hear our work cut down in such a way. I speak from experience having been on the receiving end of quite a few poorly reviewed games. Now don't get me wrong -- it is the critics' job to point out if something is or is not worthy of a consumer's dollar.
All I ask is for some tact when writing or saying these things. The way the game media presents itself perpetuates the public view that games should not be taken seriously as an art form. Trust me when I say we know when our product is not good. I'm just asking for the courtesy of professionalism.
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Comments (81)
I wish Grin the best of luck. What makes me sad is they had a great list of games, but like most developers stayed in the confines of a box.
As for your article nicely written. I do agree some journalist go over board by exagoration. (sorry my spelling sucks) Now I see if a gamer can understand when people over do things. How ever the general gaming public who are oblivious to certain things are not. Those are the people who are really effected by them.
Maybe they should be towned down, but then again even though you are a consumer it is your responsibility to prove the press/media wrong.
I think a way that is where a place like Bitmob stands out because us the community is saying how we feel on games, reviews & other things of that nature.
Maybe I ranted more then I should have. Please come back and write more and Welcome to Bitmob.
As for your article nicely written. I do agree some journalist go over board by exagoration. (sorry my spelling sucks) Now I see if a gamer can understand when people over do things. How ever the general gaming public who are oblivious to certain things are not. Those are the people who are really effected by them.
Maybe they should be towned down, but then again even though you are a consumer it is your responsibility to prove the press/media wrong.
I think a way that is where a place like Bitmob stands out because us the community is saying how we feel on games, reviews & other things of that nature.
Maybe I ranted more then I should have. Please come back and write more and Welcome to Bitmob.
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August 13, 2009
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Eric, I REALLY want to start naming names, but considering the title of your article, I will be professional and not name names. I do completely agree with you. I make levels in Little Big Planet, and I know they are not the best, but if a critic started bashing what I spent time on, instead of offering some positive feedback, I would be pissed. Especially in the age of video games we live in where a "broken" game can be patched! Why do critics, and I won't name names, not realize this?
On a side note, I would not take anything said on most podcasts seriously, for I think a few people sometimes drink too much, and end up sounding like idiots. Why do some video game journalists assume that everyone drinks? I am a smoker, not a drinker, and for once I would like to listen to a podcast where they are passing a big joint around!
On a side note, I would not take anything said on most podcasts seriously, for I think a few people sometimes drink too much, and end up sounding like idiots. Why do some video game journalists assume that everyone drinks? I am a smoker, not a drinker, and for once I would like to listen to a podcast where they are passing a big joint around!
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August 13, 2009
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Thanks for the feed back guys.
@Lance
"On a side note, I would not take anything said on most podcasts seriously, for I think a few people sometimes drink too much, and end up sounding like idiots"
that's just it, this is a feature on a "professional gaming website". Where the same people commentating are the same ones writing the reviews and previews. It contradicts with the professional angle. I'm not saying you can't have fun with the source, by definition that's what games are all about. I just want more accountability.
@Lance
"On a side note, I would not take anything said on most podcasts seriously, for I think a few people sometimes drink too much, and end up sounding like idiots"
that's just it, this is a feature on a "professional gaming website". Where the same people commentating are the same ones writing the reviews and previews. It contradicts with the professional angle. I'm not saying you can't have fun with the source, by definition that's what games are all about. I just want more accountability.
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August 13, 2009
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I hate to play devil's advocate, but the issue with some of the media you are consuming is that (especially in the case of podcasts and the millions of 'enthusiast' websites) a lot of those folks are not exactly what I would consider games journalists.
As an outsider, I have no problem listening to the opinions of the journalists I respect and tuning out all the rest of the noise. I admit that negativity is harder to swallow when you have a peronal stake in the product, but sometimes you have to take a few on the chin, so to speak.
In a perfect world, it's nice to expect everyone to be professional, but people posting reviews and talking about games on their podcasts are generally more worried about performing a service to their readers/listeners. They don't have any obligation to the developers, especially with all the crap developers have been pulling in recent years with trying to "buy" good review scores by trading exclusives or other such things.
Let's be honest. The whole system seems to be broken now and there is animosity on both sides of the fence. However, when you reduce it to its simplest form, a crappy game is still a crappy game, whether you are nice or snarky about it.
As an outsider, I have no problem listening to the opinions of the journalists I respect and tuning out all the rest of the noise. I admit that negativity is harder to swallow when you have a peronal stake in the product, but sometimes you have to take a few on the chin, so to speak.
In a perfect world, it's nice to expect everyone to be professional, but people posting reviews and talking about games on their podcasts are generally more worried about performing a service to their readers/listeners. They don't have any obligation to the developers, especially with all the crap developers have been pulling in recent years with trying to "buy" good review scores by trading exclusives or other such things.
Let's be honest. The whole system seems to be broken now and there is animosity on both sides of the fence. However, when you reduce it to its simplest form, a crappy game is still a crappy game, whether you are nice or snarky about it.
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August 13, 2009
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@Jay,
Yes a crappy game is a crappy game. But there are more succinct ways of stating this. Remember constructive criticism is the key here. Also Though I didn't state names, all of the media outlets I go to for my gaming info are the big ones so to speak: 1up, IGN, GameTrailers, Gamespot, Giant Bomb, Kotaku, Jostiq...
Game "Journalists" by definition should be providing information not entertainment. It is the same problem in "mainstream media". Sensationalism sells more I guess. If a individual has something personal to say about something it should be an editorial and stated that it is not intended to be taken as part of the websites duties.
Yes a crappy game is a crappy game. But there are more succinct ways of stating this. Remember constructive criticism is the key here. Also Though I didn't state names, all of the media outlets I go to for my gaming info are the big ones so to speak: 1up, IGN, GameTrailers, Gamespot, Giant Bomb, Kotaku, Jostiq...
Game "Journalists" by definition should be providing information not entertainment. It is the same problem in "mainstream media". Sensationalism sells more I guess. If a individual has something personal to say about something it should be an editorial and stated that it is not intended to be taken as part of the websites duties.
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August 13, 2009
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Please don't get me wrong here. I'm not defending any of the actions of the people you are referring to. I'd like to think that if they love games as much as I do, they would strive to be constructive. Open and honest discourse helps to advance the medium as a whole.
I'm trying to look at the issue from the other side of the fence. Consider the fact that games journalism is going through a rough time right now, especially if you consider printed media (or lack therof.) Despite how the individual journalists at the large sites feel personally, these companies are in business. Part of being in business involves making money. The journalists are under increasing pressure from the corporate overlords to increase revnue, whether it is from additional clicks, ad sales, etc. Despite the best efforts of some of these people to remain true to the spirit of journalism, sometimes they are forced to make hard decisions that don't always turn out best for games as a medium in general.
If you look objectively at online media in general, sensationalism is what gets attention (as you say yourself). Being polite and constructive may get you respect, but saying something in a different way that sets you apart from your competitors (even if it is negative) is what is going to attract visitors.
There is a flip side to this as well. While I support your plea for more professionalism and accountability, your statement that they should "be the professional you're supposed to be" sounds more like you're expecting it, rather than asking politely for it. Is this mincing words? Quite possibly. However, this type of approach often fails in diplomatic actions.
You also state that "we know when our product is not good." If that's the case, you realistically have to have some idea why it is not good. Journalists are still gamers, just like you and I are gamers. All three of us are capable of saying whether or not a game was fun and why. It's not the sole responsibility of journalists.
On a more generic note, if game developers (not necessarily you) want more constructive feedback or even praise, how about trying to not keep forcefeeding us the same derivative drivel with new and improved graphics and expecting us to show interest? If real, constructive feedback is offered, and the issues are still not addressed after the Nth iteration, do you really expect people to continue to devote time to the issue in a constructive way?
Also, you mention hoping to elevate games to the level of books and movies. Have you seriously spent any time reading the things that get published by movie and book critics? If so, you may actually start liking games journalists.
I do agree with you in spirit. I wish the whole world were more civil. I'm just trying to provide a perspective from someone who is examining this issue from the outside.
I'm trying to look at the issue from the other side of the fence. Consider the fact that games journalism is going through a rough time right now, especially if you consider printed media (or lack therof.) Despite how the individual journalists at the large sites feel personally, these companies are in business. Part of being in business involves making money. The journalists are under increasing pressure from the corporate overlords to increase revnue, whether it is from additional clicks, ad sales, etc. Despite the best efforts of some of these people to remain true to the spirit of journalism, sometimes they are forced to make hard decisions that don't always turn out best for games as a medium in general.
If you look objectively at online media in general, sensationalism is what gets attention (as you say yourself). Being polite and constructive may get you respect, but saying something in a different way that sets you apart from your competitors (even if it is negative) is what is going to attract visitors.
There is a flip side to this as well. While I support your plea for more professionalism and accountability, your statement that they should "be the professional you're supposed to be" sounds more like you're expecting it, rather than asking politely for it. Is this mincing words? Quite possibly. However, this type of approach often fails in diplomatic actions.
You also state that "we know when our product is not good." If that's the case, you realistically have to have some idea why it is not good. Journalists are still gamers, just like you and I are gamers. All three of us are capable of saying whether or not a game was fun and why. It's not the sole responsibility of journalists.
On a more generic note, if game developers (not necessarily you) want more constructive feedback or even praise, how about trying to not keep forcefeeding us the same derivative drivel with new and improved graphics and expecting us to show interest? If real, constructive feedback is offered, and the issues are still not addressed after the Nth iteration, do you really expect people to continue to devote time to the issue in a constructive way?
Also, you mention hoping to elevate games to the level of books and movies. Have you seriously spent any time reading the things that get published by movie and book critics? If so, you may actually start liking games journalists.
I do agree with you in spirit. I wish the whole world were more civil. I'm just trying to provide a perspective from someone who is examining this issue from the outside.
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August 13, 2009
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@Jay
Very well said! I agree with a lot of what you say. Game developers fall prey to their corporate overlords (i.e. the publisher) many times. They are the ones paying the bills what they say goes... most times, unless you have a proven track record. Even then trust me it's tough to operate under complete autonomy. As for your comment:
"how about trying to not keep forcefeeding us the same derivative drivel with new and improved graphics and expecting us to show interest?"
Well just like in movies and books there are trends. Twilight is the hot thing right now... hence tons of Vampire books. Transformers made millions, now you have another 80's cartoon property: GI Joe. Making games is a business, but yes I think even within games just meant to make a buck there are ways to be creative. I'm not saying game developers are perfect either....
Very well said! I agree with a lot of what you say. Game developers fall prey to their corporate overlords (i.e. the publisher) many times. They are the ones paying the bills what they say goes... most times, unless you have a proven track record. Even then trust me it's tough to operate under complete autonomy. As for your comment:
"how about trying to not keep forcefeeding us the same derivative drivel with new and improved graphics and expecting us to show interest?"
Well just like in movies and books there are trends. Twilight is the hot thing right now... hence tons of Vampire books. Transformers made millions, now you have another 80's cartoon property: GI Joe. Making games is a business, but yes I think even within games just meant to make a buck there are ways to be creative. I'm not saying game developers are perfect either....
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August 13, 2009
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I don't begrudge you making money any more than I do the gaming journalists. I know equally well that sometimes developers have to make sacrifices so that the studios and publishers can remain profitable, and thus, continue to make games.
The gaming press is analogous to the movie and book press now. Critics in their industries tear apart sequels and derivative works with just as much fervor and snark as you see here. In modern society, it's almost become par for the course when you're working in any kind of popular media.
On a personal note, I reject most popular trends in movies and books just as often as I do in video games. I hold movies and books to my own equally high standards as I do with video games when I make purchasing decisions. I do stand by my statement, though I also understand the reality of your situation.
I'm sorry that the rest of the world is driven by market hype, but that's just the reality of the world we live in.
The gaming press is analogous to the movie and book press now. Critics in their industries tear apart sequels and derivative works with just as much fervor and snark as you see here. In modern society, it's almost become par for the course when you're working in any kind of popular media.
On a personal note, I reject most popular trends in movies and books just as often as I do in video games. I hold movies and books to my own equally high standards as I do with video games when I make purchasing decisions. I do stand by my statement, though I also understand the reality of your situation.
I'm sorry that the rest of the world is driven by market hype, but that's just the reality of the world we live in.
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August 13, 2009
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Wow wouldn't you know it. Bit Mob proves my point right on the front page with this flippant response to a bunch of people losing their jobs
"Tis a shame to hear about developers shutting down. We blame you guys -- why didn't you buy their crappy games? Think about someone else for a change."
"Tis a shame to hear about developers shutting down. We blame you guys -- why didn't you buy their crappy games? Think about someone else for a change."
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August 13, 2009
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@Eric Hum you do bring up a point. How ever as a gamer I think it is making lite of a bad situation. Though many may not see it that way that is how I am taking it as a gamer. While I only fault bad Humor.
As seeing your point that if one was not to know Michael does this with bad jokes. How ever that being said i can't make no excuse for anyone and just my thoughts. So do you hold the thoughts of any who says something on that site or do you blame the who site?
Eric I honestly hope work is going good for you and if you ever need to talk to someone my e-mail is 2old2play.atc@gmail.com . I listen very well and will be confidential as well.
As seeing your point that if one was not to know Michael does this with bad jokes. How ever that being said i can't make no excuse for anyone and just my thoughts. So do you hold the thoughts of any who says something on that site or do you blame the who site?
Eric I honestly hope work is going good for you and if you ever need to talk to someone my e-mail is 2old2play.atc@gmail.com . I listen very well and will be confidential as well.
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August 13, 2009
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@Toby
I hold each person accountable to themselves. Michael should know better. People lost their jobs and in this world economy that is no joking matter.
I don't know how Bit Mob operates. I don't know if Shoe edits all of the posts by the staff. I would hope that he does but it doesn't seem like it...
As for me, I am fortunately in a stable place at my job... It wasn't the case not too long ago, and I will say this Meta-critic, and game rankings factor into negotiations with publishers. So think about that the next time you read an unfairly harsh review.
I hold each person accountable to themselves. Michael should know better. People lost their jobs and in this world economy that is no joking matter.
I don't know how Bit Mob operates. I don't know if Shoe edits all of the posts by the staff. I would hope that he does but it doesn't seem like it...
As for me, I am fortunately in a stable place at my job... It wasn't the case not too long ago, and I will say this Meta-critic, and game rankings factor into negotiations with publishers. So think about that the next time you read an unfairly harsh review.
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August 13, 2009
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@Eric I don't reviews for games as I only read previews of games. Personally I like to dive deep into the game as possible before playing the game. Some times my own efforts make me not want to buy a game.
Yes losing a job is no laughing matter. Please still stay and write how you feel as that what this is all about. Communication is key to such things.
Yes losing a job is no laughing matter. Please still stay and write how you feel as that what this is all about. Communication is key to such things.
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August 13, 2009
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Great blog. A couple of points though.
As you commented about some reviewers stating "I'm no game designer but..." That's exactly right. Most reviewers aren't game designers. Their job is to let the people know weather a game is worth your dollars or not.
As a consumer I don't want a review that tells a game company how to make their games. If a company doesn't know that it is offering a shitty game to people they don't deserve to have people offering soft reviews. If a game is broken, it's broken, bottom line.
As you commented about some reviewers stating "I'm no game designer but..." That's exactly right. Most reviewers aren't game designers. Their job is to let the people know weather a game is worth your dollars or not.
As a consumer I don't want a review that tells a game company how to make their games. If a company doesn't know that it is offering a shitty game to people they don't deserve to have people offering soft reviews. If a game is broken, it's broken, bottom line.
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August 13, 2009
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@Eric - But if a reviewer tells you what was bad about the game, does that not also give the developer a pretty good idea of what they needed to fix?
An example could be Fat Princess. Over at the Titan Studios blog, they are already talking about changing the warrior class a little to make it more useful. And if you read a lot of the reviews, most are saying that the Warrior is useless. I have even stated this on Bitmob!
Another point is that of a video game studio with 70 people, how many of those people actually have creative control? One? Three? Maybe even ten? So that leaves 60 people who were just doing what they were told, and are now fired for doing so. If God of War sucked, which it does not, but if it did, everyone would have blamed Jaffe, for he had creative control. Would it really be fair to say that the studio made a bad game, or just Jaffe made a bad game?
However, to change to my point of view, when the Crystal Dynamics closed many journalists were saying how sad this was, for the studio lead was a really dedicated guy. Is it just a coincidence that Crystal Dynamics was located in San Francisco, and Grin is in Sweden?
I smell a conspiracy! Oh, wait, that smell is just me, sorry
An example could be Fat Princess. Over at the Titan Studios blog, they are already talking about changing the warrior class a little to make it more useful. And if you read a lot of the reviews, most are saying that the Warrior is useless. I have even stated this on Bitmob!
Another point is that of a video game studio with 70 people, how many of those people actually have creative control? One? Three? Maybe even ten? So that leaves 60 people who were just doing what they were told, and are now fired for doing so. If God of War sucked, which it does not, but if it did, everyone would have blamed Jaffe, for he had creative control. Would it really be fair to say that the studio made a bad game, or just Jaffe made a bad game?
However, to change to my point of view, when the Crystal Dynamics closed many journalists were saying how sad this was, for the studio lead was a really dedicated guy. Is it just a coincidence that Crystal Dynamics was located in San Francisco, and Grin is in Sweden?
I smell a conspiracy! Oh, wait, that smell is just me, sorry
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August 13, 2009
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@Lance then the same could be said for Damnation and how that whole ordeal went down as well.
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August 13, 2009
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@ Lance- Yes your 1st point is a good one and reviews do have a place as feedback for game companies to use. I didn't mean my comment to have a hostile tone, however I just believe that the ultimate responsibility lies with the publishers/developers.
What about companies that hold their games back from the reviewers until they hit the sale date? They know they're putting a piece of shit game out and they're going to make the reviews come out late because of it. I can imagine this tactic has caused some extra fuel to be thrown on an already bad fire if you get my meaning.
I do get the fact that the whole team doesn't have creative control over a project. I think it's horrible for those folks to lose their jobs based on the mistakes of their bosses.
What about companies that hold their games back from the reviewers until they hit the sale date? They know they're putting a piece of shit game out and they're going to make the reviews come out late because of it. I can imagine this tactic has caused some extra fuel to be thrown on an already bad fire if you get my meaning.
I do get the fact that the whole team doesn't have creative control over a project. I think it's horrible for those folks to lose their jobs based on the mistakes of their bosses.
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August 13, 2009
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@Toby - There you are! I think we should start singling out who is in charge creatively in these companies, and not bad mouth the whole team.
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August 13, 2009
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@Lance that would be wrong ... I mean in these games someone must step up and say this is not going to go well. So I really want to know now is when something is said internally why is something not done then?
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August 13, 2009
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@Eric - I sensed no hostility in your tone, but that disemboweled cat you sent to my door was really freaky!!!! 
As far as publishers who hold the game back, I think only big publishers can afford to do that. And you are completely correct that it fuels the fire if the game is not too good.
As far as publishers who hold the game back, I think only big publishers can afford to do that. And you are completely correct that it fuels the fire if the game is not too good.
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August 13, 2009
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@Toby - Interesting. You are suggesting a democratic revolution in game development?!!!
To be serious, I think that the higher ups in a given company tell the creative lead how much time they have, and the creative lead must try his or her best to make the game as good as they can in that time. So, like everything else in this world, we can blame capitalism.
To be serious, I think that the higher ups in a given company tell the creative lead how much time they have, and the creative lead must try his or her best to make the game as good as they can in that time. So, like everything else in this world, we can blame capitalism.
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August 13, 2009
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@Lance I always am for PRO Gamer if you have not noticed then Developer and Publisher last of course.
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August 13, 2009
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@Lance
I do expect game reviewers to point out what was wrong with the game, but I want them to break it down. Explain why something is a issue with them, in a clear concise way that is not "snarky" or condescending.
And more than one person makes a game. Every game I have worked on afforded me the chance to put my creative spin into it, and I've yet to be a project lead.
David Jaffe did not make God of War. Sony Santa Monica made God of War. It takes A LOT of people to make a game. If it "fails" whether critically or commercially, then the blame falls on the team.
@Eric King
As a consumer I don't want a review that tells a game company how to make their games. If a company doesn't know that it is offering a shitty game to people they don't deserve to have people offering soft reviews. If a game is broken, it's broken, bottom line.
I'm not asking for "soft" reviews" I want hard in depth reviews presented with professionalism. I want conversations on video games, and their success or failings presented with care and respect for the men and woman who worked very hard on them.
Also holding game back just because of reviews doesn't happen. It costs A LOT of money to hold a game back. If a game is held it is because of the belief that it will make more money by doing so. Either due to an increase in quality, or less competition.
If a publisher wants to dodge bad reviews they will just not provide a copy to the press. But I don't want to derail the conversation here.
BTW Crystal Dynamics did not close down. They had layoffs, they are still making games.
I do expect game reviewers to point out what was wrong with the game, but I want them to break it down. Explain why something is a issue with them, in a clear concise way that is not "snarky" or condescending.
And more than one person makes a game. Every game I have worked on afforded me the chance to put my creative spin into it, and I've yet to be a project lead.
David Jaffe did not make God of War. Sony Santa Monica made God of War. It takes A LOT of people to make a game. If it "fails" whether critically or commercially, then the blame falls on the team.
@Eric King
As a consumer I don't want a review that tells a game company how to make their games. If a company doesn't know that it is offering a shitty game to people they don't deserve to have people offering soft reviews. If a game is broken, it's broken, bottom line.
I'm not asking for "soft" reviews" I want hard in depth reviews presented with professionalism. I want conversations on video games, and their success or failings presented with care and respect for the men and woman who worked very hard on them.
Also holding game back just because of reviews doesn't happen. It costs A LOT of money to hold a game back. If a game is held it is because of the belief that it will make more money by doing so. Either due to an increase in quality, or less competition.
If a publisher wants to dodge bad reviews they will just not provide a copy to the press. But I don't want to derail the conversation here.
BTW Crystal Dynamics did not close down. They had layoffs, they are still making games.
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August 13, 2009
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Nice post, Eric. I agree that constructive criticism is far more valuable than simply bashing something, especially if they can't back up what they're saying. I can think of a few reviewers who do this on a regular basis, and their reviews are also poorly written.
As for what you said Jay, I agree with a lot of it, I'd be pissed at companies like Eidos too, but it's sad that game journalists are resorting to sensationalism. I mean they've done this to some degree for years, but I've always been someone who values information and things with meaning as opposed to catchy headlines and articles filled with stereotypes and meaningless drivel. I guess they have to do that to some extent to capture the mainstream, but most people who read game websites are fairly hardcore, so why not write mostly for your audience?
As for what you said Jay, I agree with a lot of it, I'd be pissed at companies like Eidos too, but it's sad that game journalists are resorting to sensationalism. I mean they've done this to some degree for years, but I've always been someone who values information and things with meaning as opposed to catchy headlines and articles filled with stereotypes and meaningless drivel. I guess they have to do that to some extent to capture the mainstream, but most people who read game websites are fairly hardcore, so why not write mostly for your audience?
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August 13, 2009
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I want conversations on video games, and their success or failings presented with care and respect for the men and woman who worked very hard on them.
Eric, I think you will find exactly that at Bitmob. And I understand that Sony Santa Monica made God of War, but are you trying to say that any member of the team has an equal say as Jaffe? I don't think so. I have read enough articles, and seen enough documentaries on God of War to know that Jaffe was the Captain of that ship. Cory Balrog and others were huge factors, but Jaffe had final say.
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August 13, 2009
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@ Eric Kozlowsky- Maybe I didn't phrase my point in the right way. I didn't mean a company would delay a game from its ship date. I was talking about companies that don't let a reviewer get a final build of the game in time to review it before its ship date.
While I do agree that reviewers can offer constructive feedback, I don't think you're ever going to get rid of "snarky" comments from the press.
As I said before, regardless of reviewers, companies should know if they're shipping a quality product to people. That's what testers and quality control is for. I admit I am not a game designer. With that in mind, having played games both good and bad since NES; I think it wouldn't take a rocket scientist to figure out whether or not a quality product is being offered to people. If a company doesn't like "snarky" negative feedback from the press, I would think that would be the time to step it up for the next offering and show people what they can really do.
While I do agree that reviewers can offer constructive feedback, I don't think you're ever going to get rid of "snarky" comments from the press.
As I said before, regardless of reviewers, companies should know if they're shipping a quality product to people. That's what testers and quality control is for. I admit I am not a game designer. With that in mind, having played games both good and bad since NES; I think it wouldn't take a rocket scientist to figure out whether or not a quality product is being offered to people. If a company doesn't like "snarky" negative feedback from the press, I would think that would be the time to step it up for the next offering and show people what they can really do.
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August 13, 2009
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@Eric: "Wow wouldn't you know it. Bit Mob proves my point right on the front page with this flippant response to a bunch of people losing their jobs
"Tis a shame to hear about developers shutting down. We blame you guys -- why didn't you buy their crappy games? Think about someone else for a change."
I agree, that was incredibly immature of Michael and certainly not the attitude one would expect from someone who calls himself a journalist. I wonder how the people from 1UP would have felt if the response to losing their jobs was a snark-ridden post from supposedly professional people just because they didn't happen to like the product produced. I'm profoundly disappointed to see the hardships of others made fun of in this way.
"Tis a shame to hear about developers shutting down. We blame you guys -- why didn't you buy their crappy games? Think about someone else for a change."
I agree, that was incredibly immature of Michael and certainly not the attitude one would expect from someone who calls himself a journalist. I wonder how the people from 1UP would have felt if the response to losing their jobs was a snark-ridden post from supposedly professional people just because they didn't happen to like the product produced. I'm profoundly disappointed to see the hardships of others made fun of in this way.
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August 14, 2009
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All I got out of this is "Free speech should be restricted in a bad economy because people might loose their jobs".
The weakest argument in this is the idea that if you don't make games you can't criticize them. You really want to go down this road? First of all, why would a game dev be writing game reviews? Second of all, why shouldn't someone who is just a fan of games be reviewing games. Because they don't know the hardships that go into making a game? I don't understand this train of thought at all.
Also snark is apart of all journalism, and found a lot in reviews. My favorite media publication The AV Club, has a ton of snark and cheap shots all over it. Why is this unprofessional? Most of the time there is some truth in the random snarky joke inserted. I find it makes the review all more fun to get through, while giving me the information about the game.
Also if a dev wants constructive feed back, focus test it. If you release a buggy product, don't blame the reviews for the lack of your success. It sucks that these guys lost their job, but there is no reason to blame it on others.
The last thing I have to say is that you seem to be an avid reader of all of these sites that you are blasting. I think if you are unsatisfied with the content of a site, the best thing you do is stop reading it.
SUPER BONUS: What would happened if a journalist got fired because you called them unprofessional?
The weakest argument in this is the idea that if you don't make games you can't criticize them. You really want to go down this road? First of all, why would a game dev be writing game reviews? Second of all, why shouldn't someone who is just a fan of games be reviewing games. Because they don't know the hardships that go into making a game? I don't understand this train of thought at all.
Also snark is apart of all journalism, and found a lot in reviews. My favorite media publication The AV Club, has a ton of snark and cheap shots all over it. Why is this unprofessional? Most of the time there is some truth in the random snarky joke inserted. I find it makes the review all more fun to get through, while giving me the information about the game.
Also if a dev wants constructive feed back, focus test it. If you release a buggy product, don't blame the reviews for the lack of your success. It sucks that these guys lost their job, but there is no reason to blame it on others.
The last thing I have to say is that you seem to be an avid reader of all of these sites that you are blasting. I think if you are unsatisfied with the content of a site, the best thing you do is stop reading it.
SUPER BONUS: What would happened if a journalist got fired because you called them unprofessional?
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August 14, 2009
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@ Chad- I agree with pretty much everything you brought up as well.
If reviews start reading like a manual for teaching a game company how busted their product is, then the journalists will be out of a job as well when their readers go elsewhere to find some personality in their reviews.
If reviews start reading like a manual for teaching a game company how busted their product is, then the journalists will be out of a job as well when their readers go elsewhere to find some personality in their reviews.
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August 14, 2009
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The weakest argument in this is the idea that if you don't make games you can't criticize them. You really want to go down this road? First of all, why would a game dev be writing game reviews? Second of all, why shouldn't someone who is just a fan of games be reviewing games. Because they don't know the hardships that go into making a game? I don't understand this train of thought at all.
You got this all wrong. I'm not saying if you don't make games you can't criticize them. I just want professionalism. Good hearted fun is one thing. But I'm talking about some of the down-right viciousness that is thrown about sometimes. I know it's not going to go away completely. I enjoy a lot of the humor on the sights I listed. I think the Giant Bomb crew is brilliant. I just want people to realize that their actions however small have an impact.
It might be something as small as hurt feelings, or as large as meta-critic scores hampering a publishing deal.
Furthermore if more levelheaded and mature practises were conducted I think it would go a long way in moving OUR medium in a new direction.
Now don't get me started on how the whole previews aspect of game journalism is just glorified marketing.
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August 14, 2009
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Does an overly positive review prevent more talented people looking to become a dev from getting jobs?
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August 14, 2009
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One key thing to remember in all of this is some of the people I assume you're referring to aren't pure journalists, either. I, for example, wear multiple hats, depending on the particular project I'm working on.
When I'm reviewing a game, I'm a critic, not a journalist.
When I'm interviewing someone or working on a news story, I'm a journalist, not a reviewer.
When I'm editing stories, I'm an editor, not a critic.
You get the idea. So to Chad's point above, there isn't necessarily a lot of black and white here when it comes to journalism. Michael Donahoe, for example...is as much an entertainment writer as he is a critic or a journalist. There's room for snark.
That's the beauty of gaming press...there's such a wide spectrum of available types. You have fanboys (GameFan, Play), you have serious reporting (Next Gen), you have something in between (EGM, Game Informer). Even a site like Kotaku has a huge variety in writing styles, some more sophisticated than others.
And I agree... a LOT of previews are glorified marketing write-ups. Part of that is editorial taking what PR feeds them. Part of that, though, is just our natural inclination to be optimistic in our preview coverage -- mainly cause it's unprofessional to knock an incomplete product for something that may be fixed later. That's not fair to even bring up stuff like that.
We tried opinionated previews in EGM...pretty hardcore stuff. The readers mostly loved it, but some didn't want opinion there, either. They just wanted the straight dope, and thus...it becomes marketing materials.
Bottom line: You can't win. So I give up. I'm gonna take a shower now!
When I'm reviewing a game, I'm a critic, not a journalist.
When I'm interviewing someone or working on a news story, I'm a journalist, not a reviewer.
When I'm editing stories, I'm an editor, not a critic.
You get the idea. So to Chad's point above, there isn't necessarily a lot of black and white here when it comes to journalism. Michael Donahoe, for example...is as much an entertainment writer as he is a critic or a journalist. There's room for snark.
That's the beauty of gaming press...there's such a wide spectrum of available types. You have fanboys (GameFan, Play), you have serious reporting (Next Gen), you have something in between (EGM, Game Informer). Even a site like Kotaku has a huge variety in writing styles, some more sophisticated than others.
And I agree... a LOT of previews are glorified marketing write-ups. Part of that is editorial taking what PR feeds them. Part of that, though, is just our natural inclination to be optimistic in our preview coverage -- mainly cause it's unprofessional to knock an incomplete product for something that may be fixed later. That's not fair to even bring up stuff like that.
We tried opinionated previews in EGM...pretty hardcore stuff. The readers mostly loved it, but some didn't want opinion there, either. They just wanted the straight dope, and thus...it becomes marketing materials.
Bottom line: You can't win. So I give up. I'm gonna take a shower now!
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August 14, 2009
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I think this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYRJLr90vSA clip will settle the argument. In fact this is my default clip to show people when I'm in the middle of a heated debate.
Be sure to follow through to the end!
Be sure to follow through to the end!
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August 14, 2009
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I want to say that Shoe, Demian, and everyone else at Bitmob have just shown how this is the best video game site on the planet. Why? Because instead of letting this post get buried, it is put on the front page!
That deserves a big thumbs up!
That deserves a big thumbs up!
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August 14, 2009
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Thanks for the well written and thoughtful artical Eric, but I have to completely disagree with you.
The sources you mention are NOT critics, and are under NO obligation to provide you, the developer, with constructive feedback. I think you may be confusing these journalist/entertainers with your QA department.
Again none of these sources are obligated to provide qualification to state their opinions. The "game journalism" industry is an editorial based industry. They are not technical writers and they do not work for your company. They are communicating with the public and writing about thier opinions and experiences with your games. I find most people WILL give good feedback to games that they overall enjoyed and had a good experience with, because they WANT it to be even better! I think the "snarkines" comes in generally when an experience was so bad or frustrating that the journalist does not respect the game enough to dignify it with a "professional" response. Especially if it was something they were looking forward to. Do we really want an in-depth serious analysis of why Imagine Babyz is a bad game? No! I want Seanbaby to rip it a new asshole and make me fall out of my chair laughing!
You may have a point that this is unfair, but the fault does not lie with the journalist, it is with the developer's company overreacting to silly people on a podcast having fun and sharing thier personal opinions. If companys want journalists to share constructive feedback, they should hire them!
I think we need to define what a "game journalist's" or a website/magazine's duties are exactly. They do need to convey information. That is found in the news sections and to an extent in preview content. They ALSO have a GREAT need to entertain me and inform me of thier opinions. This is how they earn thier revenue. The reviews sections and the podcasts are INHERENTLY editorial in nature. I think most of us can tell the difference when we read/listen to it. Why can't you?
It is IMPOSSIBLE to write a completly objective review of ANY art form, no matter how technical and eloquent the writer is, it will always boil down to "Did you like it?". That basic element can ONLY ever be subjective.
There is a right and wrong way to criticize something. It's called constructive feedback.
The sources you mention are NOT critics, and are under NO obligation to provide you, the developer, with constructive feedback. I think you may be confusing these journalist/entertainers with your QA department.
If you can rip on the game, but then try and justify the reason you can't come up with a better idea by saying you're not a game maker...well then what makes you qualified to tear it apart?
Again none of these sources are obligated to provide qualification to state their opinions. The "game journalism" industry is an editorial based industry. They are not technical writers and they do not work for your company. They are communicating with the public and writing about thier opinions and experiences with your games. I find most people WILL give good feedback to games that they overall enjoyed and had a good experience with, because they WANT it to be even better! I think the "snarkines" comes in generally when an experience was so bad or frustrating that the journalist does not respect the game enough to dignify it with a "professional" response. Especially if it was something they were looking forward to. Do we really want an in-depth serious analysis of why Imagine Babyz is a bad game? No! I want Seanbaby to rip it a new asshole and make me fall out of my chair laughing!
Believe it or not, game reviews go into consideration when a publisher looks to sign a deal with a development house. I can't help but think that the continual bashing GRIN received in the past 6 months had some part to play in its closure.
You may have a point that this is unfair, but the fault does not lie with the journalist, it is with the developer's company overreacting to silly people on a podcast having fun and sharing thier personal opinions. If companys want journalists to share constructive feedback, they should hire them!
Game "Journalists" by definition should be providing information not entertainment. It is the same problem in "mainstream media". Sensationalism sells more I guess. If a individual has something personal to say about something it should be an editorial and stated that it is not intended to be taken as part of the websites duties.
I think we need to define what a "game journalist's" or a website/magazine's duties are exactly. They do need to convey information. That is found in the news sections and to an extent in preview content. They ALSO have a GREAT need to entertain me and inform me of thier opinions. This is how they earn thier revenue. The reviews sections and the podcasts are INHERENTLY editorial in nature. I think most of us can tell the difference when we read/listen to it. Why can't you?
It is IMPOSSIBLE to write a completly objective review of ANY art form, no matter how technical and eloquent the writer is, it will always boil down to "Did you like it?". That basic element can ONLY ever be subjective.
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August 14, 2009
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I think you may be confusing these journalist/entertainers with your QA department.
I think the public at large is unaware of what QA is. Quality Assurance is about finding bugs, and making sure the game ships with out crashing. They (at least on the 6 games I have worked on) never provide feedback on how to make the game better. That's just not their job.
I find most people WILL give good feedback to games that they overall enjoyed and had a good experience with, because they WANT it to be even better! I think the "snarkines" comes in generally when an experience was so bad or frustrating that the journalist does not respect the game enough to dignify it with a "professional" response. Especially if it was something they were looking forward to. Do we really want an in-depth serious analysis of why Imagine Babyz is a bad game? No! I want Seanbaby to rip it a new asshole and make me fall out of my chair laughing!
This statement is the root of my argument. Why should a game that is loved by the press and public at large get special treatment? For instance a big complaint about the new Bionic Commando was the strange "twist" at the end. I didn't think it was as bad as everyone else, but hey personal tastes right? Then why was it continually mocked when all of the crazy stuff that goes on in MGS generally pass as the greatest cinematic storytelling in games (I know I'm generalizing here).
While I don't think personally that Shawn Baby is funny... at all. He is not a reviewer. His spot in EGM was clearly delineated as separate from the review crew.
Yes those game are terrible. I'm pretty sure the people who worked on them had to have known that. But does that warrant their work being torn to shreds? This is how people make a living.
Bottom line... criticism good, bashing bad.
And I agree... a LOT of previews are glorified marketing write-ups. Part of that is editorial taking what PR feeds them. Part of that, though, is just our natural inclination to be optimistic in our preview coverage -- mainly cause it's unprofessional to knock an incomplete product for something that may be fixed later. That's not fair to even bring up stuff like that.
We tried opinionated previews in EGM...pretty hardcore stuff. The readers mostly loved it, but some didn't want opinion there, either. They just wanted the straight dope, and thus...it becomes marketing materials.
Shoe, I would love to see previews go more in depth. I know you can't do this for every game, but for instance what 1up is doing with their Uncharted 2 cover story is exactly what I want to see in previews. Talk to the developers, and not just the presidents of the company. Talk to the people in the trenches, The Programers, designers, and artists. Get their take on what is their favorite aspect of the game. What did they have most fun working on?
That's what I want to know about the games I play. I don't care if a game has 5 new multiplayer maps, or 12 new guns.
I know it's wishful thinking and that it can't happen for every game but well, these are things in my mind that would make a magazine or a website more than a glorified catalog.
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August 14, 2009
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Wow. There are a lot of comments. I think the problem is not how the press reviews games. I don't think there is no need for kid gloves, and no need for constructive criticism, simply because writer's aren't writing for the industry, they write for the audience.
Speaking of no kid gloves: it's not how, but who. I've read and listened to plenty of stuff coming out of vide game outlets. The bar ain't high. While every medium has it's share of idiots writing about it, video games press is plagued with them.
To make it worse, some of the brightest minds are being snatched up by devs. When was the last time a great film reviewer was brought on as producer for a studio?
It won't get better, because video game press will have to come to maturity in the age of the internet, where you can't afford to develop your craft.
Also, the main audience (for writing, if not video games) skews younger. When I read about video games, I often feel insulted. I am a fairly intelligent late 20s family man, and I assure you, there are very few writers who write to my age or intelligence. Again, rarely does a movie reviewer write for an audience of 15-24 year olds, who (and not everyone as we have seen here at Bitmob), have much lower standards and expectations in terms of the media they consume.
Speaking of no kid gloves: it's not how, but who. I've read and listened to plenty of stuff coming out of vide game outlets. The bar ain't high. While every medium has it's share of idiots writing about it, video games press is plagued with them.
To make it worse, some of the brightest minds are being snatched up by devs. When was the last time a great film reviewer was brought on as producer for a studio?
It won't get better, because video game press will have to come to maturity in the age of the internet, where you can't afford to develop your craft.
Also, the main audience (for writing, if not video games) skews younger. When I read about video games, I often feel insulted. I am a fairly intelligent late 20s family man, and I assure you, there are very few writers who write to my age or intelligence. Again, rarely does a movie reviewer write for an audience of 15-24 year olds, who (and not everyone as we have seen here at Bitmob), have much lower standards and expectations in terms of the media they consume.
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August 14, 2009
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"think the public at large is unaware of what QA is. Quality Assurance is about finding bugs, and making sure the game ships with out crashing. They (at least on the 6 games I have worked on) never provide feedback on how to make the game better. That's just not their job."
If a game has less bugs and crashes, it will therefore be a better game. So Timothy's point still stands.
I don't quite understand this article, you don't want reviewers to "bash" a game, but critize it. I'm a pretty no-nosense guy and "bashing" and "critizing" are the same shit to me. its just semantics now.
It sucks when something is trashed when you worked on it, but that is life. EVERYONE has had something they love/appreciate/worked on completely bashed, it's part of life. Stop calling out the entire gaming media (because they are no different from other media outlets) and get back on your horse.
Learn from past mistakes (or shitty games in this case) and do better in the future. That's how I was raised.
If a game has less bugs and crashes, it will therefore be a better game. So Timothy's point still stands.
I don't quite understand this article, you don't want reviewers to "bash" a game, but critize it. I'm a pretty no-nosense guy and "bashing" and "critizing" are the same shit to me. its just semantics now.
It sucks when something is trashed when you worked on it, but that is life. EVERYONE has had something they love/appreciate/worked on completely bashed, it's part of life. Stop calling out the entire gaming media (because they are no different from other media outlets) and get back on your horse.
Learn from past mistakes (or shitty games in this case) and do better in the future. That's how I was raised.
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August 14, 2009
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I don't entirely agree with Shoe's opening to this article.
"And he doesn't have to be a game designer (or be empathetic toward one) to do it, too. Just like a movie critic doesn't need to be a movie director or actor to rip into one."
A movie critic doesn't have to be a movie director or an actor to critique a film. But they do need to know about every aspect of how a film is made (cinematography, lighting, acting, editing) and they need to be able to articulate that to the reader and explain what made the film good/bad.
I think the problem gaming journalism has is the majority of readers don't want that sort of critique. They just want to know if a game is good or bad and don't really care why. That's why you have the infamous "Why so low?" comment when Shawn Elliot game Crysis a 7. Even though his review was very written and explained in depth what was good and bad about the game.
"And he doesn't have to be a game designer (or be empathetic toward one) to do it, too. Just like a movie critic doesn't need to be a movie director or actor to rip into one."
A movie critic doesn't have to be a movie director or an actor to critique a film. But they do need to know about every aspect of how a film is made (cinematography, lighting, acting, editing) and they need to be able to articulate that to the reader and explain what made the film good/bad.
I think the problem gaming journalism has is the majority of readers don't want that sort of critique. They just want to know if a game is good or bad and don't really care why. That's why you have the infamous "Why so low?" comment when Shawn Elliot game Crysis a 7. Even though his review was very written and explained in depth what was good and bad about the game.
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August 14, 2009
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To all the people who were offended by my joke, it was OBVIOUSLY intended as sarcasm. And if you're read my writing by now, you'd *probably* know that! 
Hahaha!
Of course I'm sad that people are losing their jobs. Hell, I lost mine not too long ago. And I understand a lot goes into making games. But a bad game is a bad game, no matter the story behind it. Just like a bad movie is a bad movie. Or bad CD is a bad CD. People have to stand behind their work. It's not the consumer's problem to worry about the story behind the project. Why should they care? They're spending their money. So if the thing they buy sucks, they have every reason to get pissed off.
BTW: I LOVE EVERYONE!! UNICORNS AND RAINBOWS RULE! SO DO THE TUNNEL SNAKES!
Hahaha! Of course I'm sad that people are losing their jobs. Hell, I lost mine not too long ago. And I understand a lot goes into making games. But a bad game is a bad game, no matter the story behind it. Just like a bad movie is a bad movie. Or bad CD is a bad CD. People have to stand behind their work. It's not the consumer's problem to worry about the story behind the project. Why should they care? They're spending their money. So if the thing they buy sucks, they have every reason to get pissed off.
BTW: I LOVE EVERYONE!! UNICORNS AND RAINBOWS RULE! SO DO THE TUNNEL SNAKES!
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August 14, 2009
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I haven't read all of them comments, so I apologize in advance if something I mention has already been covered.
Eric, I find your argument quite strange. You open by discussing games as art, but then seem to have this expectation that the gaming press offer "constructive criticism" because developers have bills to pay.
Any other artistic field is inherently risky and there is no expectation that artists who continually make poorly received art be compensated simply because that's how they've been making a living. Do we think that Uwe Boll shouldn't be raked over the coals for his terrible films? No.
Quality of life issues and the business practices of publishers are somewhat related but not inherently relevant to the discussion at hand. These are separate issues, and I think they deserve to be addressed on their own terms. To use these plaguing problems of the games industry as a means to frame the way criticism of games affects game developers is not furthering debate.
In the end, though, constructive criticism is not the responsibility of the gaming press because game developers are not its audience. The game consuming public is, and the gaming press offers commentary on which games are worth their money and which are not. That's the bottom line in a system based on free-market capitalism.
Eric, I find your argument quite strange. You open by discussing games as art, but then seem to have this expectation that the gaming press offer "constructive criticism" because developers have bills to pay.
Any other artistic field is inherently risky and there is no expectation that artists who continually make poorly received art be compensated simply because that's how they've been making a living. Do we think that Uwe Boll shouldn't be raked over the coals for his terrible films? No.
Quality of life issues and the business practices of publishers are somewhat related but not inherently relevant to the discussion at hand. These are separate issues, and I think they deserve to be addressed on their own terms. To use these plaguing problems of the games industry as a means to frame the way criticism of games affects game developers is not furthering debate.
In the end, though, constructive criticism is not the responsibility of the gaming press because game developers are not its audience. The game consuming public is, and the gaming press offers commentary on which games are worth their money and which are not. That's the bottom line in a system based on free-market capitalism.
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August 14, 2009
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@Michael Donohoe-If anyone seriously took offence to that, being on the internet and obviously sarcastic in nature, needs to grow a pair...
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August 14, 2009
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@Toby-I mean this in the nicest way, but the internet is no place for super sensitive guys who can't take a joke.
Back on topic, wow this got a lot of comments. Enough that it might have the record so far.
Back on topic, wow this got a lot of comments. Enough that it might have the record so far.
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August 14, 2009
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@David it is one of the more intriguing topics and it does not compare to the Bio-Shock art book giveaway.
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August 14, 2009
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@Donahoe:
"To all the people who were offended by my joke, it was OBVIOUSLY intended as sarcasm. And if you're read my writing by now, you'd *probably* know that! smilies/wink.gif Hahaha! "
That a large number of people were bothered by it I think makes it pretty clear that the sarcasm wasn't as obvious as you think it was. Knowing your true intent now, it isn't so bad but sarcastic or not, I think poking fun at people losing their livelihoods (whether or not you think the games they made were bad) is in poor taste at best. I think if people posted something like that about when you lost your job at 1UP because they didn't like that site's opinions and then said "Lighten up man, it's only a joke!", can you honestly say you would just simply laugh it off?
"To all the people who were offended by my joke, it was OBVIOUSLY intended as sarcasm. And if you're read my writing by now, you'd *probably* know that! smilies/wink.gif Hahaha! "
That a large number of people were bothered by it I think makes it pretty clear that the sarcasm wasn't as obvious as you think it was. Knowing your true intent now, it isn't so bad but sarcastic or not, I think poking fun at people losing their livelihoods (whether or not you think the games they made were bad) is in poor taste at best. I think if people posted something like that about when you lost your job at 1UP because they didn't like that site's opinions and then said "Lighten up man, it's only a joke!", can you honestly say you would just simply laugh it off?
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August 14, 2009
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A big chunk of this discussion seems to be focused towards podcasts, most of which are inherently off-the-cuff. Podcasts following the old 1UP Yours format of several guys openly discussing a set of predetermined topics tend to be extremely frank -- the hosts and guests speak to one another as they normally would, without much consideration for professionalism. It's not like writing a review or opinionated article in print or text where the writers have time to revise their statements with a clear audience in mind. Eric, you apparently view this as a negative, holding that these people are "journalists" and have a duty to remain professional in these cases. But speaking in snarky, hyperbolic tones or using colorful language is something real people will occasionally do when talking to one another openly. These unscripted discussions help to bond the readers/listeners to the writers precisely because they offer viewpoints that are less filtered with careful consideration to others. As Anthony Fitch would say, it's "raw".
Reviews are a different beast. But you can't expect the same level of considerate professionalism in most of these podcasts, especially when they offer no pretense for it.
Reviews are a different beast. But you can't expect the same level of considerate professionalism in most of these podcasts, especially when they offer no pretense for it.
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August 14, 2009
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@Gerry- That's part of the problem right there. Everyone wants to be a victim nowadays rather than take responsibility for their own actions. Should people have to tip-toe around for their whole lives because of the risk of offending someone? Bullshit!
If someone made jokes about me losing my job I'd do what most sane rational people should do: Not pay any attention to it and devote all my brain power to finding a new gig.
If someone made jokes about me losing my job I'd do what most sane rational people should do: Not pay any attention to it and devote all my brain power to finding a new gig.
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August 14, 2009
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Wow, there's so many comments that the content of this comment changed twice in the way down here.
1. I live in a country (Colombia) where no real video games are produced, however we make some movies, movies that I find tasteless, horribly written and planned and just plain bad, but apparently journalist can't say that, because "hey! it's a local movie, no matter how bad it is WE MUST SUPPORT IT, AND IF YOU DON'T DO IT YOU HATE YOUR COUNTRY AND ITS HARD-WORKING PEOPLE" (Okay, maybe I shouldn't wrote all that on caps).
2. The difference between "criticism" and "bashing" is a matter of personal sensibilities, and even the way everyone of us is raised, so it's very hard to say what is "criticism" and not "bashing", you should write real examples of what do you consider "bashing".
3. The "politically correct" writing style in games journalism was contaminated in the 80's and 90's by too much PR people fending as journalists, the first game magazine I read was Club Nintendo, its wirting was very "politically correct", making some "constructive criticism" on games but stating the they were great nonetheless. Years later in my gaming experience I found that those games weren't as good as Club Nintendo told me, so I switched to GamePro, and, ultimatlely to EGM/1UP. So, maybe a few years before publishers PR pull their finger out of the gaming press maybe that style can be associated with something else that a mouthpiece of some company.
4. In my line of word (Actionscript developer) the results of my job are judged by the clients, none of which is an actionscript developer and could possibly know nothing about programming, web or anything else, yet those people can put me out of my job, it's a reality the we can't avoid.
Whew, that was long, thank you to anyone who endured.
1. I live in a country (Colombia) where no real video games are produced, however we make some movies, movies that I find tasteless, horribly written and planned and just plain bad, but apparently journalist can't say that, because "hey! it's a local movie, no matter how bad it is WE MUST SUPPORT IT, AND IF YOU DON'T DO IT YOU HATE YOUR COUNTRY AND ITS HARD-WORKING PEOPLE" (Okay, maybe I shouldn't wrote all that on caps).
2. The difference between "criticism" and "bashing" is a matter of personal sensibilities, and even the way everyone of us is raised, so it's very hard to say what is "criticism" and not "bashing", you should write real examples of what do you consider "bashing".
3. The "politically correct" writing style in games journalism was contaminated in the 80's and 90's by too much PR people fending as journalists, the first game magazine I read was Club Nintendo, its wirting was very "politically correct", making some "constructive criticism" on games but stating the they were great nonetheless. Years later in my gaming experience I found that those games weren't as good as Club Nintendo told me, so I switched to GamePro, and, ultimatlely to EGM/1UP. So, maybe a few years before publishers PR pull their finger out of the gaming press maybe that style can be associated with something else that a mouthpiece of some company.
4. In my line of word (Actionscript developer) the results of my job are judged by the clients, none of which is an actionscript developer and could possibly know nothing about programming, web or anything else, yet those people can put me out of my job, it's a reality the we can't avoid.
Whew, that was long, thank you to anyone who endured.
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August 14, 2009
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@Eric King - Just because you can say anything you want on the internet doesn't mean you should. We're all capable of a little self-control, and there are always ways to make every point without being offensive to someone.
There are a lot of people in this country without jobs right now. A lot of them are worried about also losing their cars, homes, and possibly families. This type of situation often leads to people not being sane or rational.
There are a lot of people in this country without jobs right now. A lot of them are worried about also losing their cars, homes, and possibly families. This type of situation often leads to people not being sane or rational.
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August 14, 2009
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As a co-host on one of these unproffessional podcasts i would agree with you. I say what i want with no regard for the developer, whether it be positive or negitive. I think someone said something about drinking when doing the podcast, guilty of that too. However, grow up. I am 28 and work as an auditor. Do you have any idea of the amount of shit i take on a dialy basis. You have a dream job. I sacrifice and put in an insane amount of time at my job. Yet we get blamed any time the economy goes in the shitter... Enron, Madoff, etc. I do our podcast for fun. I get no free-bees from anyone, i buy all my games new and encourage people to by new on my show because i care about you the developer. So do i feel entitled to speak freely about what i spent my hard earned money on? What do you think. Podcasts about video games are nothing more than a conversation. Our entire show is off the cuff the only thing we prepare is a main topic (last week it was about gurrila marketing and videogames). I think thats why podcasts are popular for our hobby. Peoples eyes glaze over when you talk about videogames. So podcasts are our outlit to have in depth, and often ridiculus, conversation about games. I would think as a developer this would be the place to go to get feedback. Hearing people speak their mind about a game when they are not worried about pissing off a PR rep. I love this industry and care about it's growth and the people involved in it. Ultimately, if you make a shit game who's fault is that. By the way, i loved too human, so sometimes these podcasts go against the norm.
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August 14, 2009
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As far as I'm concerned, the day that media resembles anything that like the idea portrayed in the original post, is the day I quit visiting sites or purchasing magazines, gaming or otherwise. I, as a consumer, have absolutely no interest what could have been improved upon in a game that wasn't all it was expected to be, or could have been had things worked out differently. Sure, I enjoy a post-mortem as much as the next guy, I want to hear what a developer learned, not hear some journalists idea on what could have been improved. After all, they're not developers, right?
Media needs page views, subscribers or numbers heading in a positive direction regardless of what format they appear in. If they were all to have an epiphany and realize that they've just been plain mean all of these years and someone is suffering because of it, those numbers start going down. Simple because your idea of the media would be largely uninteresting to those of us who have become familiar with personalities in the enthusiast press.
The bottom line is that as a consumer, I don't care if someone who designed a bad toaster, car, movie, or game suffers because of negative press that they incur due to "bashing" of any sort. No one has any responsibility to provide a pillow for these people to land on, and developers simply aren't the audience they're providing content for. At the end of the day, I want to know if a game is a piece of garbage, and enjoy hearing how much of a piece of garbage it is. The same goes for film, vehicles, cameras, and any other topic I'm interested in.
Media needs page views, subscribers or numbers heading in a positive direction regardless of what format they appear in. If they were all to have an epiphany and realize that they've just been plain mean all of these years and someone is suffering because of it, those numbers start going down. Simple because your idea of the media would be largely uninteresting to those of us who have become familiar with personalities in the enthusiast press.
The bottom line is that as a consumer, I don't care if someone who designed a bad toaster, car, movie, or game suffers because of negative press that they incur due to "bashing" of any sort. No one has any responsibility to provide a pillow for these people to land on, and developers simply aren't the audience they're providing content for. At the end of the day, I want to know if a game is a piece of garbage, and enjoy hearing how much of a piece of garbage it is. The same goes for film, vehicles, cameras, and any other topic I'm interested in.
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August 14, 2009
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@Jay- Yes I agree with your point that people shouldn't just let loose with comments to intentionally offend someone.
However, people need to understand that the world doesn't owe them shit. If I go out and spend $50 or $60 on a pile of garbage for a game; I'm going to let everyone and their brother know it was a piece of shit.
I'm not telling people the game is shitty with the intentions of putting the creators of it out of a job, but nobody can tell me that a company doesn't KNOW it's shipping a piece of trash for a game.
However, people need to understand that the world doesn't owe them shit. If I go out and spend $50 or $60 on a pile of garbage for a game; I'm going to let everyone and their brother know it was a piece of shit.
I'm not telling people the game is shitty with the intentions of putting the creators of it out of a job, but nobody can tell me that a company doesn't KNOW it's shipping a piece of trash for a game.
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August 14, 2009
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@Jeff - Sure, you have the right to say anything you want on your own podcast, but telling other people to "grow up" and your own bitterness with the profession you chose are not really part of a legitimate justification for that right. I'm reasonably sure you're not the only one here who does not like his job or doesn't dream of making games. A large portion of us also work long hours and make sacrifices for our respective careers.
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August 14, 2009
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@Jay- I am not bitter and i do like my job. I was just saying that he choose to make entertainment his proffesion and that with that choice come ramifications. One of which is that his consumer is the public. When he does bad at his work he has to take some flak, when i do bad at my job i get sued. But getting sued is a part of the proffesion I choose to be in. I can't wish away lawers just like he can't wish away the public
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August 14, 2009
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@Donahoe: Sometimes sarcasm is hard to pull off in writing. 
I suggest adding cool shades to the end of every sentence you write to let people know you're only kidding.
I suggest adding cool shades to the end of every sentence you write to let people know you're only kidding.
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August 14, 2009
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I think the public at large is unaware of what QA is. Quality Assurance is about finding bugs, and making sure the game ships with out crashing. They (at least on the 6 games I have worked on) never provide feedback on how to make the game better. That's just not their job.
I should have made this point clear. You're right that what you're looking for is not the job of the QA dept., but my suggestion would be that companies hire (or contract with) someone like Shoe or Donahoe to give them thier personal and honest opinions about the game as development goes along. I think you are forgetting all the MANY times that journalists DO give constructive feedback in thier reviews and even on podcasts. For example, I have heard a lot about Little King's Story recently and several people liked the game but knocked the scores due to things like having to go to a specific person to save, and not being able to use the Wii pointer in the interface. This is certainly the constructive feedback you are looking for! The only problem is it is far to late to be "constructive" at this point since the game is already released. Did the developers know those kind of comments would be made ahead of time? They should! Maybe if more companies did this, AND implemented the feedback of thier "pre-reviewrs", we would have less opportunity for the bashing you despise so much.
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August 14, 2009
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@Jeff - I'm not trying to speak for Eric, but it seems to me that he is not trying to wish away the public nor does he wish to take zero flak. He is asking for them to be a little more constructive with their flak. While this is possibly not a realistic expectation, it doesn't seem like something we couldn't all shoot for.
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August 14, 2009
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If you can rip on the game, but then try and justify the reason you can't come up with a better idea by saying you're not a game maker...well then what makes you qualified to tear it apart?
I have heard the mirror argument when a reviewer suggests changes tactfully, by saying they aren't a developer, what gives them the right to suggest changes? It seems no matter what tactics the reviewer takes when tackling a bad game, the developer/publisher isn't going to be happy and will pick apart the review.
Trust me when I say we know when our product is not good.
I have a REAL hard time believing this comment, because it seems to be based on advertising. Budget titles I have seen labeled as bad by the developer/publisher, despite it being a really good game (duck amuck was regarded as poor at best by dev/pub because it's a budget title, despite it turning out really well), and AAA titles being incredible works of art, only to get hammered for a variety of reasons (assassins creed, a "meh" game regarded by ubisoft as the crown jewel of their company)
People spend their lives making these games -- it takes years to produce just one product. Very often, insane hours are involved that are very destructive to the developers' personal lives and health (yes even on budget titles no one cares about). We read these reviews and listen to these podcasts.
And I've heard this argument before, repeatedly. I will say to you what has been said to the others using this argument: That's not their job to consider the emotions of the people who made it. Their job is to review a game and tell the consumers their opinion if it's worth having.
The article does sound like sour grapes to me. In the past when reviewers were limited to magazines or newspapers, the developer/publisher could throw their weight around to get good reviews by either bribing or threats on the reviewer's boss. These days, that tactic is not nearly as effective, because large organizations aren't trusted and indie reviewers can't be forced. So there is little to do but complain about the reviews.
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August 15, 2009
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@Michael - 
There is nothing better than a pixelated, stroke victim to spread the love!
There is nothing better than a pixelated, stroke victim to spread the love!
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August 15, 2009
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@Lance - hahahahaha, oh man. Great, now a stroke victim is going to start yelling at us for being insensitive to the plight of the stroked.
Thats meant to be read as stroke-ED. Not stroked. Meaning someone thats been afflicted with a stroke, instead of some who has been stroked somewhere.
Thats meant to be read as stroke-ED. Not stroked. Meaning someone thats been afflicted with a stroke, instead of some who has been stroked somewhere.
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August 15, 2009
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@Alex -
I would like to just reaffirm my respect from all stroke victims.
Except this one:
This is Former Canadian Prime Minister, and stroke victim, choking a protester!
He does his dirty work himself!
I would like to just reaffirm my respect from all stroke victims.
Except this one:
This is Former Canadian Prime Minister, and stroke victim, choking a protester!
He does his dirty work himself!
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August 15, 2009
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given all the comments and Shoe's statement at the onset...my biggest issue is your last couple of sentences. How does one demand professionalism when full well knowing they may be working on a product that isn't up to their own professional standard?
This isn't to say you are 'wrong' or 'right' for asking...its just interesting to demand such a thing when both sides of the table are fully aware that Game X could have been better given a more professional touch.
This isn't to say you are 'wrong' or 'right' for asking...its just interesting to demand such a thing when both sides of the table are fully aware that Game X could have been better given a more professional touch.
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August 15, 2009
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I love how developers are so quick to bash the games press, game retail and the consumer before gathering up the balls to point the finger at the real 'biggest' problems in video games right now- The publishers and the developers themselves.
They are the ones trying to make a quick buck by churning out quick hit pieces of shit like Terminator: Salvation- a game which this writer needs to play before even thinking of commenting on Grin as a development house.
What Grin did was take on too many projects - three game releases in about six months if I remember right- and not give any of these three major releases the love and care they needed to become true top-tier games deserving of a $60 price, above 7 reviews and anything coming close to being called a successful release.
Instead they pooped out three sub par games that all ended up in bargain bins and ultimately led to the demise of this studio.
Here are the true lessons that should be learned from Grin's fate-
1. Don't over extend your development studio- It is always better to release one great game than three floating turds.
2. Don't charge $60 for a 6 hour game- Word got out quick that Wanted and Terminator were not just bad games, they were so short that I had people who came into my store to buy it that morning trying to return it that afternoon after beating it in one short session.
3. Don't make shit and expect the gaming consumer and press to give you a pass on it.
BTW- I find it a bit funny that someone calling for 'professionalism' in making comments would not take the time to go rent the other products made by a company they have decided to write a piece defending... Just saying.
They are the ones trying to make a quick buck by churning out quick hit pieces of shit like Terminator: Salvation- a game which this writer needs to play before even thinking of commenting on Grin as a development house.
What Grin did was take on too many projects - three game releases in about six months if I remember right- and not give any of these three major releases the love and care they needed to become true top-tier games deserving of a $60 price, above 7 reviews and anything coming close to being called a successful release.
Instead they pooped out three sub par games that all ended up in bargain bins and ultimately led to the demise of this studio.
Here are the true lessons that should be learned from Grin's fate-
1. Don't over extend your development studio- It is always better to release one great game than three floating turds.
2. Don't charge $60 for a 6 hour game- Word got out quick that Wanted and Terminator were not just bad games, they were so short that I had people who came into my store to buy it that morning trying to return it that afternoon after beating it in one short session.
3. Don't make shit and expect the gaming consumer and press to give you a pass on it.
BTW- I find it a bit funny that someone calling for 'professionalism' in making comments would not take the time to go rent the other products made by a company they have decided to write a piece defending... Just saying.
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August 15, 2009
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They are the ones trying to make a quick buck by churning out quick hit pieces of shit like Terminator: Salvation- a game which this writer needs to play before even thinking of commenting on Grin as a development house.
I have to be clear on this, and I don't want to be pulled into a flame war. No one in the game industry WANTS to make a bad game. Everyone I work with, have worked with, and probably will work with puts their all into the games they make. Sometimes the pieces to come together for many reasons.
When talking about a game like Terminator, or Wanted. I'm guessing there was a lot of pressure from the publisher, and movie studios to ship the title in a very small time frame.
Brutal Legend looks amazing, want to know why? It's been in development for 4 years. Not everyone gets the opportunity to work on 20 million dollar plus budgets. But they do their best with what they have. Sometimes I guess it's not enough. What I want to know is why do people take it so personally when a game is bad? If you spent the money on it and weren't satisfied that is one thing. But judging at the copies sold of the games in question it doesn't seem like that was very many people.
3. Don't make shit and expect the gaming consumer and press to give you a pass on it.
Where is this notion that I want a pass on things? I want bad games to be called out as such. I just want other adjectives other than this game is shit, or something to that effect.
You my friend are a prime example of my argument. Thankfully you're not in the gaming press. I find it odd the animosity coming from you. As if GRIN or other studios producing something perceived as low quality, have personally insulted you.
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August 15, 2009
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One more thing, I guess it's obvious that we'll all never agree, and that's cool with me. I just wanted to put this out there for thought and invite debate. It obviously struck a cord with almost 100 responses. I just hope the next time you play a game, read a review, or listen to a podcast, realize that all those faceless names that scroll by in the credits are people who, despite popular opinion worked pretty damn hard to try and bring you even a modicum of entertainment.
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August 15, 2009
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I'll actually respond seriously now. I agree with Isaiah here, in that if the people working on the game know its not up to their own standards, and the press has the responsibility to say that it isn't up to gamers standards, then the only ones that can be blamed here are the bigwigs greenlighting and paying for these games to be pumped out.
Obviously its sad when anyone loses their jobs, but you can't get upset when people like Donahoe are just acting goofy for entertainment purposes. He still respects the situation, its a very few amount of people that actually wish negative situations on people for having made a bad game. The majority of gamers understand that it's not always the people who made its fault.
Sure, jokes about something like that are going to sting if you yourself are closer to that situation, but you have to understand that behind the joking is most likely a full understanding of the people that have been hurt. I listen to somewhere around 6 or 7 game podcasts and everyone I've heard mention the Grin fiasco has said how sad it was, even if they made a little joke about it.
But I do fully agree with you that reviews of bad games should still be treated respectfully. Reviews like a seanbaby review, while funny, are pretty much something we could do without in the gaming press. Except that in a seanbaby review it didn't matter how much he bashed the game because the game was guaranteed to sell millions of copies anyway.
Obviously its sad when anyone loses their jobs, but you can't get upset when people like Donahoe are just acting goofy for entertainment purposes. He still respects the situation, its a very few amount of people that actually wish negative situations on people for having made a bad game. The majority of gamers understand that it's not always the people who made its fault.
Sure, jokes about something like that are going to sting if you yourself are closer to that situation, but you have to understand that behind the joking is most likely a full understanding of the people that have been hurt. I listen to somewhere around 6 or 7 game podcasts and everyone I've heard mention the Grin fiasco has said how sad it was, even if they made a little joke about it.
But I do fully agree with you that reviews of bad games should still be treated respectfully. Reviews like a seanbaby review, while funny, are pretty much something we could do without in the gaming press. Except that in a seanbaby review it didn't matter how much he bashed the game because the game was guaranteed to sell millions of copies anyway.
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August 15, 2009
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It sure seems like to want to give bad games a pass, just because people worked hard on them.
It seems like you are asking us to try to look at things from the perspective of the developer, without taking the time to look at things through our eyes.
Most people cannot afford to buy two or three $60 games a month. With today's strict return policies, these customers are stuck with two options if they did not like a game they bought- trade it in for a small portion of the money they spent on the game, or take it to the local firing range and use it for target practice.
I think the exact opposite of you. I think the press and consumers are too soft on bad games. I think that review scales are way too tilted to handing out 7's, 8's and 9's and that too many bad games are given 5's and 6's... which should be average and above average game scores.
As someone who works game retail I get to deal with the frustrated customers who want to return opened new games because they are not good. I get cussed at and yelled at because a publisher pushed out a game for a quick profit rather than respecting games consumers. I am on the front lines having to do my best to help customers find a game that they will enjoy, while developers get to sit in anonymity and just read about people's frustrations rather than seeing it first person.
This is what I think people feel when they buy a bad game- They feel disrespected because they were dumb enough to fall for the PR of a publisher who wants to make a quick buck off of their hard earned money.
I think the way companies like Activision and at time EA see game consumers is despicable, and I expect more from this industry because I know it is capable of it.
I do agree with you that reviews should offer up clear reasons of why they dock a game's score, but I also think it is important to get word out as quickly as possible when a game is bad, so that more consumers are not turned away from gaming as a hobby because unlike seeing movies or buying music, games is a very expensive form of entertainment.
Since games want to be treated like premium entertainment and ask $50 or $60 for a game compared to $10 or $20 for a DVD or CD, then I think publishers and developers should expect more rabid criticism when they do not deliver a quality experience, since their price point infers that the product will be such.
I think the new trend of games not being reviewed in mass before they release is creating a situation where more people are buying bad games because they do not know any better. I think publishers holding onto code or not preparing a game enough to have it reviewed before it releasing is more than just a bit unethical
I just hope that next time a game of yours ships that you will realize that each of your sales was made from people who work hard for their money, and if you are selling them a bad product then you have not just hurt those consumers personally- you will also have damaged this industry which we all love so much... And that is a much greater crime than calling a game 'shit' without taking the time to explain why.
It seems like you are asking us to try to look at things from the perspective of the developer, without taking the time to look at things through our eyes.
Most people cannot afford to buy two or three $60 games a month. With today's strict return policies, these customers are stuck with two options if they did not like a game they bought- trade it in for a small portion of the money they spent on the game, or take it to the local firing range and use it for target practice.
I think the exact opposite of you. I think the press and consumers are too soft on bad games. I think that review scales are way too tilted to handing out 7's, 8's and 9's and that too many bad games are given 5's and 6's... which should be average and above average game scores.
As someone who works game retail I get to deal with the frustrated customers who want to return opened new games because they are not good. I get cussed at and yelled at because a publisher pushed out a game for a quick profit rather than respecting games consumers. I am on the front lines having to do my best to help customers find a game that they will enjoy, while developers get to sit in anonymity and just read about people's frustrations rather than seeing it first person.
This is what I think people feel when they buy a bad game- They feel disrespected because they were dumb enough to fall for the PR of a publisher who wants to make a quick buck off of their hard earned money.
I think the way companies like Activision and at time EA see game consumers is despicable, and I expect more from this industry because I know it is capable of it.
I do agree with you that reviews should offer up clear reasons of why they dock a game's score, but I also think it is important to get word out as quickly as possible when a game is bad, so that more consumers are not turned away from gaming as a hobby because unlike seeing movies or buying music, games is a very expensive form of entertainment.
Since games want to be treated like premium entertainment and ask $50 or $60 for a game compared to $10 or $20 for a DVD or CD, then I think publishers and developers should expect more rabid criticism when they do not deliver a quality experience, since their price point infers that the product will be such.
I think the new trend of games not being reviewed in mass before they release is creating a situation where more people are buying bad games because they do not know any better. I think publishers holding onto code or not preparing a game enough to have it reviewed before it releasing is more than just a bit unethical
I just hope that next time a game of yours ships that you will realize that each of your sales was made from people who work hard for their money, and if you are selling them a bad product then you have not just hurt those consumers personally- you will also have damaged this industry which we all love so much... And that is a much greater crime than calling a game 'shit' without taking the time to explain why.
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August 16, 2009
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As a games reviewer, I have no problem with someone asking for a little tact when critiquing someone's work. All too often, when I read reviews by other folks, I see adjectives that color things black without offering any real reason why or why not a particular mechanic in a game works. I'm far from perfect, but I do try to make it my personal business to offer detailed descriptions of where and why I get hung up in a game. Though I don't hold back from negative comments one bit, I try to use wording that is accurate. I think too many reviewers overdo it in an attempt to make a review read in a more entertaining way. Reviews also have to be entertaining in much the same way a game does, but whereas a game's ultimate goal is usually to entertain, a review is meant to inform. So yeah, reviewers should classify things intelligently.
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August 16, 2009
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One thing that i find interesting is that because i may curse in my podcast, that means i am not being proffessional. And that i should show some respect for the people that have worked so hard to make a game. When i think something is a peice of shit i say so, except i actually use the word shit. Have you actually listened to so called "proffessional critics" when they don't like something? I have heard Siskal and Ebbert tear movies to shreds in their reviews. I mean just destroy movies. Food critics are even worse. A chef has put their reputation on the line, invested their life saveings into a resturant and a food critic will shred them in a review. The only difference between them and myself is that i will actually say the word shit. They just cover it up by useing large words and impressive adjitives. But it is quite obvious when they think something is crap because spend so much time in a thesorus looking for other ways to say shit. By the way i know i can't spell, wish this thing had a spell check
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August 17, 2009
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OK, I wanted to come back to this post and say that yes, I do see where you are coming from to a degree. In many ways we have dehumanized developers by both lifting them up to this mostly unattainable standard and also be not thinking about the work that goes into getting every game made. I do think we are too quick to lob pointed attacks at those games and developers we think wronged us by making a bad game, and we probably should take more time to respectfully voice our opinions on games.
A large part of my frustration at all of this games from feeling like games consumers have less advocates for them every day, while the press is already bending over backwards for developers and publishers by giving them overly positive previews that often times misinform consumers as the the current quality of the games demoed by the press.
If you look at the way the press covers issues like the used game market and digital downloads you will see that often they are taking the side of developers and publishers over the rights of consumers.
I also see games consumers getting ripped off every day by the company I work for, Gamestop.
I am getting more and more concerned that the relationship between the press and developers and publishers is becoming too tight, and that this is leading to more consumers getting stiffed in the end by not having the information they need to wisely by games.
I do think my initial responses were a good example of people quickly lashing out... but I still defend my right to do so due to the current climate in gaming.
Should it be this way? Fuck no! But I do think that it is a symptom of the sickness of this industry, not the whole sickness.
I will always stand up for the consumer over devlopers and publishers any day. Without them no game publishers or game sites would exist, and they are getting ripped off more and more every day.
A large part of my frustration at all of this games from feeling like games consumers have less advocates for them every day, while the press is already bending over backwards for developers and publishers by giving them overly positive previews that often times misinform consumers as the the current quality of the games demoed by the press.
If you look at the way the press covers issues like the used game market and digital downloads you will see that often they are taking the side of developers and publishers over the rights of consumers.
I also see games consumers getting ripped off every day by the company I work for, Gamestop.
I am getting more and more concerned that the relationship between the press and developers and publishers is becoming too tight, and that this is leading to more consumers getting stiffed in the end by not having the information they need to wisely by games.
I do think my initial responses were a good example of people quickly lashing out... but I still defend my right to do so due to the current climate in gaming.
Should it be this way? Fuck no! But I do think that it is a symptom of the sickness of this industry, not the whole sickness.
I will always stand up for the consumer over devlopers and publishers any day. Without them no game publishers or game sites would exist, and they are getting ripped off more and more every day.
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August 17, 2009
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Now this is a topic I can get behind. It seems very common these days that the tact a reviewer has in written word gets lost, at times, in a podcast. Sensationalism runs rampant on many a podcast because it's more entertaining. As an example, it's worth noting the increase in the number of video game podcasts brandishing explicit labels (my show included). But having a shock-jock mentality when it comes to podcasting shouldn't override a reviewers integrity and professionalism when it comes to talking about a particular title. As for needless bashing in a written review, writers should just know better at this point. Sure, a bad game deserves a bad review, but it doesn't need to be so brash that it borders on insulting.
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August 26, 2009
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